Okay, I know that “firsters” isn’t really a word. But it is descriptive. So, we have a new President, and supposedly the world rejoices. Here is a clip that shows the joy…
I love Barack Obama for what he has done. Maby terrorists wouln’t hate america so much if they stopped putting their nose where it certainly does not belong. And stop acting like it’s the best country in the world because it is NOT!!!! With Obama I think America will see a lot more peace. I certainly hope so! He knows what he is doing.
I think that the person that has that blog is from Britain. Is then Britain “the best country?”
note: the post was left sic.
–post by Patrick
The difference between the US and other western countries? Americans are more open whether it’s about pride or distrust of their own government. Other western countries may feel they are superior, but they just don’t have the balls to say it as they would then be revealed as hypocrites. Little do the Americanophobes know that we already see them as such as it is not so much as what is said or not said, but how one behaves that makes it a dead give-away that they think their shit doesn’t stink.
I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again. Americans rock because of their honesty.
Do yanks think they’re number one? Erm… Not really.
The Guardian, which is a mainstream British newspaper featured this article- “Obama, the Imperialist” which basically likens him to Bush and says how his message of Change is false. I was wondering when they would start whining about Obama. That’s all their journalism is: whine, whine and whine some more. I for one am not going to give up on him so easily.
Hey VM! Was wondering where you’ve been. Glad to see you’re back on the job! And Jane, I gave up on Obama when I found out about his “God damn America!” church. Nobody who follows such a religion deserves to be sitting in the White House. People might as well have voted for Osama ben Laden.
@ SA: So, let me get this straight. Your mind is made up about Obama for the next four years from 2 years ago? o_O No matter what he does? At least liberals could come up with a long list of policy complaints on Bush. So far the Right has nothing but pre-presidential irrelevancies on Obama. Surely the far left judged Bush’s past on his AWOL records, and their assumption that he couldn’t run the country if he couldn’t even fight in a war is no different from the irrelevancy you bring up. Now, if Obama takes his hatred for the US into his term, then it’s relevant. This conclusion jumping and not having the slightest bit of an open mind is what differentiates the Right from the Far Right. And just in case you try to bite me there, I never ever jumped to conclusions before Bush had a TRUE chance to screw up DURING HIS PRESIDENCY.
Aaaah, in any event if your mind is completely closed, already made up, and are just falling victim to ODS for “revenge against those evil liberals” as you mentioned earlier on this blog, what is the sense in arguing anyway?
Anywho…… Didn’t you notice that I already called for Obama’s impeachment?
Obama hates America and American people. It is very clear to me. That is why I am so proud to be an American! Allah is great.
As the Pro-American Rush Limbaugh said, “I hope Obama fails as president”. I disagree with him. I hope Obama succeeds. Why? Because I want my own country destroyed. Because if my country is destroyed, so will my loved ones, my family and I be destroyed. Nothing will make me happier as an American-hating American.
Allah is great! Death to my country, my loved ones, and me.
Doesn’t everyone already know how much I hate America?
Gads VM…
Where the hell is Zontar when ya need him! Probably waiting in line at an airport?
LMAO!
He’s scrambling to the airport as now he’s worried that the secret service is coming here due to my latest post. J/K It really sucks that I had to edit one of my tags. It just takes the flavor away. “Assasinate Obama now” – I guess is not very secret service friendly.
Just so long as they don’t find out that you have a copy of my book; “Political Assassination for Fun and Profit.” j/k
Damn. Where can I hide that?
Yep, my mind is made up. I intend to give Osam…er Obama the same respect that liberals gave to Bush, which is to say, NONE!!!!
And btw VM, do you really believe that Obama, that scion of the hate America left, really intends to fight terrorists? That’s not a rhetorical question. I really want to know what you think. Also, how can you, while insisting you’re so patriotic, dismiss Obama’s TWENTY year membership in a hate America church as irrelevant? If McCain had been a member of a Christian Identity church for twenty years I bet you wouldn’t dismiss that as irrelevant.
I think that’s the key difference between you and I. I DON’T have an opinion. Obama hasn’t made any decisions yet. So, I have nothing to go on.
Because I want to judge him as a president – not a person. This isn’t match.com. I don’t need a husband or a friend. Just a president.
And once again, by your standards, I am not a patriot. So, please give up already on persistently questioning my patriotism. We obviously don’t agree on what that word means.
Do you have something to back that up with? Well, of course not! You just like to put words in my mouth and make assumptions which is the gut of most of your arguments.
@SA, again:
Revolving your politics around revenge…. don’t you find that a bit juvenile? If you really like revenge-politics, I think you’ve got it bass-ackwards. The Left got revenge on YOU this time because our man won. Your party got sold out. Your party is now the minority voice. And you cannot handle it. And you’re supposed to be the “party of classiness”. But your words are showing no higher-road than how the Left reacted during the Bush presidency. As a matter of fact, you are acting much worse than the Left because at least the left had Bush’s presidency to judge!!!!!!!!!! LOL
VM, VM, VM! The Left judged Bush on his presidency? Please! Liberals began trashing Bush the minute he won in 2000. In fact, liberals STILL refuse to admit that Bush did, in fact, win in 2000. To this day they insist he stole the election. Gimme a break! You liberals spent eight years calling Bush a Nazi, and that was one of the nicer things you said about him. But the minute you smell even a whiff of ill will toward Obama you demand conservatives take the “higher road”. And we know what that means: shut the you-know-what up!
The Left was upset with the nature of Bush’s winning of the presidency. That was the bulk of the criticism until the Iraq War runup. From then on, full-on incompetence, cronyism, and naive faith in the voices in his head gave most of the rational world material with which to criticize him.
Meanwhile, the hardline GOP types have been bashing Obama for things they’ve been guilty of for the past 8+ years. Understandable, given they’re hurting now, and anyone who’s not paying attention can be led to believe whatever they’re told time and time again (something right-wing talk radio does well). But those of us who *do* pay attention can see GOP attacks as more of the Manichean paranoia we’ve all gotten tired of.
Libs weren’t trashing Bush. They were trashing the system and justifiably so! Al Gore won the popular vote. The EV is supposed to mirror the popular vote by the citizens and it didn’t in 2000. In history, that marks the fourth time that has happened. That’s not the fault of Bush, but the EV.
Never once did I call Bush a Nazi. But true. I called him many names – a war criminal is one that comes to mind. You’re confusing the far left with old fashioned liberals again. But if you are so hell bent about name-calling and the usage of dictators to represent a leader, you are a bold-faced hypocrite when you call Obama “OSama”. Why is it only OK for your party to do whatever the hell they want? But the Left must submit to the rules you don’t even follow yourselves?
Now tell me. Am I going insane? Who exactly (if you can name names) is “demanding” that you give respect to Obama? Humor me!
What you often misunderstand is that there is a huge huge difference between disagreements and silencing speech or “making demands”.
SA, the bottom line is. If you are going to accuse an entire party of anything, then you shouldn’t do those things yourself. It is very hard to take hypocrites and those who dish out double-standards seriously. And it is really not fair, either.
“If you are going to accuse an entire party of anything, then you shouldn’t do those things yourself. It is very hard to take hypocrites and those who dish out double-standards seriously. And it it really not fair, either.”
You perfectly described liberals here, VM, and the sad part is you don’t even know it. While hypocrisy is a human failing, not a liberal or conservative one, you libs are the ones practicing it big time now. Like I’ve said before, you libs bashed and demonized Bush the way the Nazis bashed and demonized Jews. For eight years you wallowed in political and ideological hatred; it was the air you breathed. But now that you’re in power you suddenly want civility and fairness to reign. That’s what I meant when I said that libs are demanding respect for Obama. Maybe I should’ve said expecting respect for Obama. Maybe that word wouldn’t have gotten your nose so bent out of joint.
You call me a bold-faced hypocrite for calling Obama Osama. Well, did you object to Bush being called Hitler? I suspect not since you yourself called him a barbarian and a war criminal. Yet you are aghast–aghast I tell you!–at li’l ol’ me calling your messiah out of his name. Who’s the hypocrite, VM? I guess it takes one to know one. I wasn’t being hypocritical when I called Obama Osama, I was giving you libs a taste of your own medicine. It’s funny to see how much you don’t like it.
And what is this “EV” you’re talking about? Do you mean EC, i.e. the electoral college?
A politician is not an entire ethnic group. Any politician who makes mistakes and poor, self-serving decisions as bad as Bush did deserves to be called every name in the book. If it’s any comfort to you, Seane-Anna, GWB is still filthy rich, protected from harm, and isn’t being marched to the gas chambers.
And I agree, Obama was called Osama not for his poor decision-making and leadership, but as a racial slur.
The GOP really needs to grow up. Hopefully someone with an ounce of brain matter will seize the reins and throw out the partisan, religious hacks that have dominated the party for the past 20 years.
*just shakes my head in amusement*
It really is nice not belonging to either, or any, political party. That way I can sound off on any of them…
You are pointing out the blind spot that exists within yourself. On every account in your comments here, you are condemning those people guilty of the very things that you do yourself. The very fact that you cannot see that proves my case no matter how many red herrings you pull out of your bag of tricks so that you don’t have to take responsibility for your own actions and words.
The difference between you and I is that I challenge text that you’ve actually typed out. You have to make up things that I say to compensate for not having an argument.
As usual, SA, you are unable to name names. Now, if you want me to take you seriously, please humor me and point out where I’ve said these things. Actually, your accusations against ME is proof that you don’t read my blog or even care what I think about these issues you bring up.
Please substantiate these claims you are making so that I have a chance to either back down or defend my position.
Proof please? How am I personally expecting respect for Obama when I haven’t even formed a solid opinion of him, myself????
I could give a rat’s ass what anyone thinks of Obama. You could be talking about my mailman. If something is said about anyone or any group that is hypocritical or reeks of double standards and hyperbole, I point it out no matter who is the topic of conversation. OH yes, ma’am – even Bush. But see? You wouldn’t want to believe that. Your deluded fantasies work so much better, don’t they?
Actually, I did. Twice on my blog. I’ve even pointed that out to you on two different occasions. You just completely ignored it.
As a matter of fact, I have (shocker!!) defended Bush quite a few times over the last 4 years on this blog.
SA, calling him a war criminal and likening him to a dictator are two different things. It’s sad that you cannot note these differences, and it’s making me wonder if it is even worth the time to debate with you.
Secondly, the term “Messiah” is coming from YOUR mouth. Not mine.
Could you do me a big favor, SA? I would really appreciate it if you would kindly stop putting words in my mouth and assuming things about me, my beliefs, my politics, and my values unless they can be backed up. You seem not to be interested in a thoughtful debate. If you want to “get me” on something, here’s an idea: QUOTE SOMETHING THAT I’VE ACTUALLY SAID as opposed to those things that you’ve dreamed up to further your agenda.
My own medicine? Please once again humor me. Where have I likened Bush to a dictator? Please find that text, and then you’ll have an argument.
Hypocrisy is when you do those things that you don’t want others to do. But the definition changes when you are guilty of it yourself. You are a hypocrite of the worst kind when you justify hypocrisy under the veil of “giving those a taste of their own medicine”.
Your “revenge-politics” are silly. Your arguments are presumptuous and very childish.
I meant the EC – the electoral college. They are supposed to mirror the POPULAR VOTE – not what YOU want or like the popular vote to be.
In plain English, I loathe most of Bush’s policies. I have eight whole years to have come to this assertion. Thank you very much.
“Other western countries may feel they are superior, but they just don’t have the balls to say it as they would then be revealed as hypocrites. Little do the Americanophobes know that we already see them as such as it is not so much as what is said or not said, but how one behaves that makes it a dead give-away that they think their shit doesn’t stink.”
This is fucking stupid. Other western countries don’t feel superior. And btw that was my blog you got the Obama thing from and I AM NOT BRITISH! When you “borrow” a bit of someones blog post you should check who they are before you write:
“I think that the person that has that blog is from Britain. Is then Britain “the best country?”.
I don’t have a favorite country, but no the US is not on the top of my list, however I am not an americanphobe. I used to live in America.
And one more thing. I do not belive that the problem lies with the American people, it’s the leaders. They do war like some kind of sick sport. And the soliders don’t even know what their really fighting about. People are getting hurt for now fucking reason. USA have acheved nothing. Sadam might be dead, but that just leaves his country in kaos without a leader to controll things.
Tough stirasi, I sourced it right back to you and your spiteful writing. Looked like you were promoting Britain, from Britain to me, so that is how I called it.
Don’t like America, or Americans? Then go and establish your own nation. It might take a bit of “sick sport” though, so I doubt that will happen.
Would you rather that Saddam and sons still had their rape rooms and all the rest? How about gassing thousands of people, mostly women and children? Our soldiers know what, and why they are there.
BTW, I was against going into Iraq from the very beginning and I still believe that it was a mistake.
For JM,
“…GWB is still filthy rich, protected from harm, and isn’t being marched to the gas chambers.”
Yeah, just like Obama.
“The GOP really needs to…throw out the partisan, religious hacks that have dominated the party for the past 20 years.”
That would make the GOP into the Democrats, the party of partisan, anti-religious hacks. No thank you.
“…Obama was called Osama…as a racial slur.”
I happen to be Black, so that blows your racism accusation out of the water, at least with regards to me. But I’m not surprised by it. America elects a Black president and liberals still fall back on their pet grievance. When all else fails, cry racism. It’s pathetic.
Stiras1, you’re a jerk. Crawl back under your America hating rock and STAY THERE!!!!
VM, *sigh*. I don’t know what to say to you. How am I putting words in your mouth? I never said you called Obama the messiah. I call him that to make the point that you liberals are acting like he’s the messiah. And you are. I never said you personally had demanded or expected respect for Obama. I said that you liberals are doing that. Apparently you’re having a hard time distinguishing between “you” singular and “you” plural, or I’m not making that distinction plain enough. Sorry.
I do take slight offense at you calling me a hypocrite for calling Obama Osama when you admit that you’ve called Bush names. You ask when did you liken Bush to a dictator. You called him a barbarian and a war criminal. You say calling Bush a war criminal and likening him to a dictator are two different things. Are you kidding me? That’s like saying calling someone a nigger and calling someone a jungle bunny are two different things. And what’s this about you not having an opinion of Obama? You voted for the man, didn’t you? You must have some opinion of him. Sheesh!
And do you really believe that Obama intends to fight terrorism? You never did answer that question. And to answer your question, you called Bush a barbarian in a post back in November, I believe. I remember reading it. I missed your defense of Bush. Links, please. And I have an agenda? Really?
@SA, I found your comment in my spam box. Please accept my apologies for it showing up here late. I don’t know how or why it was auto-spammed. Nothing I did, anyway.
Yes, I do see an unjustified war and a dictator two totally different things.
My opinion of Obama? Pre-presidential judgements and my opinion of his presidency can possibly be different. Can they not? We are into his presidency now. How can I complain or applaud him so early on? I am not that type of person. I wait for one to do or not do something before I form an opinion.
As far as the pre-presidential Obama is concerned… not everything he said or did stroked me the right way. Why did I vote for him? Because politically speaking, he and I are on the same plane … and that is for the most part.
I don’t trust that Obama will do all that he has promised because I can never be so gullible. However, is it a crime for me to trust that he will deliver something positive – something positive at all? Can I not have any hope at all? I am happy with what I am seeing so far. But if you want to get technical, I cannot seriously judge how he is as a president because I haven’t gotten to see what’s he’s got to offer this country and the world. Again, it is too early.
Do I believe that he intends to fight terrorism? Yes. Could I be wrong with my trust in him? Of course.
Now, I never did call Bush a barbarian. Where did you find that I said that. See, there you go putting words in my mouth. Hun. You need to stop that.
I have provided links to you already on where I have defended Bush. I am tired of having to repeat myself again and again. It is up to YOU to believe me. It is your choice.
Why are all things black and white in your world. Why must I hate everything about Bush? Why must one on the Right love everything about Bush. He, in my opinion, was unfairly judged on occasion to which I defended him. But I will say it again, I HATE most of Bush’s policies. He is not as bad as some have made it out to be and has been the target of hyperbole. But I am glad he’s gone. I DO NOT LIKE BUSH AS A PRESIDENT.
Obviously, we define some terms here and there differently. Such is life.
One more thing, SA: when you say, “you liberals”, you are including me. Can I give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you are talking about the far left or do you lazily smudge them all in together like coconut and rum is to a Pina Colada?
There are some fundamental basics that bond the general Left and Liberals, naturally. But from what I see, the radicals should be seen as a separate entity on to their own. I see them as being mentally ill. There are many radicals out there – enough to create blogs over and share outrage. However, in the grand scheme of things, they DO represent the minority when compared with the rest of the world.
Seane-Anna:
“…GWB is still filthy rich, protected from harm, and isn’t being marched to the gas chambers.”
Yeah, just like Obama.
No, just like everybody. So stop the comparisons to treatment by Hitler; it just makes you look like an utter fool.
“The GOP really needs to…throw out the partisan, religious hacks that have dominated the party for the past 20 years.”
That would make the GOP into the Democrats, the party of partisan, anti-religious hacks. No thank you.
Are you delusional? Did you miss the fact that Democrats are almost as likely to invoke “God and country” as the Republicans? At least they know where to draw the line between church and state.
I suspect, however, most Republicans agree with you and you’ll continue to act like children until someone with actual vision leads you in a different direction. We might be waiting for a while.
“…Obama was called Osama…as a racial slur.”
I happen to be Black, so that blows your racism accusation out of the water, at least with regards to me. But I’m not surprised by it. America elects a Black president and liberals still fall back on their pet grievance. When all else fails, cry racism. It’s pathetic.
I don’t give a good goddamn that you’re black; you’re obviously unclear that racism can be directed to non-black people, and being black doesn’t clue you in. This wasn’t a general comment about Obama being a victim for his race; this was the use of “Osama” as a nickname by people like you because of his father’s Muslim background.
Ugh…why do I bother responding to people who are clearly trolls? I think I’ll stop now.
To Seane-Anna
What? So now I’m a jerk because I don’t like the way America is always involved i some kind of war. I mean just take a little time to think what you are saying. Just because I don’t like the america government (like most of the world btw) does not make me an american hater. I have american friends, I have lived in america. I am just saying that war is a bad thing and it seems to me it is the american governments solution to everything. USA went into Iraq because they said they had mass destruction weapons, they did not, but Bush does not remove your soliders, you get rid of Sadam (good job), but you don’t get out of Iraq, american forces are still there and the country is now struggling because they don’t have a leader to control them. I am not saying Sadam wasn’t bad, but what are people going to do now huh… You can’t just take away a dictator and expect the country to peacfully continue in a democracy. Don’t get all angry with me because I actually think about consequences.
stiras1; We are always involved in some kind of war? For the better part of the last one hundred years America has not been involved in formal warfare. We have however, been being attacked by Muslim’s constantly at least since the 70’s. But, I suppose that is alright?
Just because you lived here does not make you an American, or a lover or hater of things American. Read VM’s blog, and you will find more Americans bashing America than the rest of the world wants to believe.
The war’s legal base was for treaty violations, and had nothing at all to do with WMD’s. That’s a red herring. BTW, a ton of yellow cake was in fact located. Stuff that into an air burst weapon, then set it off upwind of a major metropolitan area, or heck, a nation. View the results, and then say that it’s nor WMD.
Did Bush et al screw up the aftermath of the Iraq invasion? well, if you listen to just about everyone in America then the unequivocal answer is yes. Further, one does not need a degree in Military Science to figure that one out. However, the fact of the matter is that we did go there and break the damned thing. (Iraq)
Now, for some damned reason, we think we have a moral obligation to fix it. Question; Why is it that you think we should not still be in Iraq ( and/ or Afghanistan) attempting to make life better for the people in those places? Is it because their skin is brown? Or perhaps because they follow a different religion? In case you haven’t noticed our people, troops and civilians alike have been building schools (even for women! Heaven forbid!) and infrastructure. Removing land mines left over from previous wars, and teaching the local peoples how to do those things for themselves once we have left.
Those evil Americans, and their evil government! They never ever think about the lasting consequences of their war mongering ways, now do they (?)!
stiras1: Your only crime is exaggeration. We’re not always at war. Keep in mind that every country with relative power has always been given to war. If Norway were 100 times as big, it might have been a war-starting nation, too.
Patrick: stiras1 confined his criticism to the government, which I think is generous given the percentage of Americans supporting attacking Iraq in the runup to the war in 2003. And, please, don’t delude yourself: the Iraq war was never about making a better life for other people (if that were the case, many, many times more are being killed in Darfur than ever in Iraq). The work is, at this point, stabilization, which, of course, involves building civilian infrastructure.
The weapons found notwithstanding (esp since none of it was ever enough to mount a preemptive war on a country for it), the main reason we attacked Iraq was for oil. This has been confirmed by many affiliated, allied actors such as Poland.
“Patrick: stiras1 confined his criticism to the government, which I think is generous given the percentage of Americans supporting attacking Iraq in the runup to the war in 2003″
Alright, I may have misinterpreted the communication.
“And, please, don’t delude yourself”
I said the legal reason i.e. International law and the treaty. Which also addresses “enough to mount a preemptive war on a country for it”
“esp since none of it was ever enough”
I had no idea that you were an expert in radiation related illnesses. For my part I have cared for a lot of yellow cake miners that died horribly from cancers related to mining uranium, and they had “protective gear” that limited the amounts of material inhaled or ingested.
Yep, it was all about oil! Not that western economies would last a year without oil. It must have been all about that though, since the wonderful low prices at the pump last year were a direct result of warfare economics. Or was that so that Cheney would have a cushy retirement? I forget, I mean really, I can’t keep up with all those war for oil conspiracies.
BTW, I argued against going to Iraq in part because I believe that if we did in fact need to stick our collective noses into other countries business we should have went to Sudan or Zimbabwe. We had our hands full with Afghanistan then, still do, and never should have even attempted any other foreign excursions at least until we had that tigers tail chopped off. But I digress…
Okay I guess we’re on the same page. I mean ofcourse I want to help those poor people too, but I feel like all I see is the harm that’s being done. I’m not saying that the Americans haven’t helped at all, but you guys must admit that a lot of shit has happened. There have been terrible losses on both sides. Around here everyone always says it was for oil and I do belive that too. Why should soilders and sivilians die, for oil.
One more thing. America has been attacked by terrorists, but you have not had a war in America in a very long time. Yes soliders die, but the people are usualy safe. People here are still remebering what they went through in WWII and that is why we hate war. My gradmother tells me stories all the time about how scary it was having soliders going through the streets of Norway. We had them in our country and we do not forget.
There must be a better way of dealing with things.
I’ve got a problem with this idea of diving in unannounced to “help” a country. It reminds me of the Christian crusades. It’s called “cultural interference”. And the Iraq experience has borne out my concerns. Tyrants usually rule because the cultural ways predispose them to rule. Get rid of one tyrant and another will rise to replace him (externally imposed tyranny such as Russia in eastern Europe notwithstanding). I regard the Iraq invasion as opportunistic, foolish adventurism on the part of the “coalition of the willing” – which was comprised of more countries than just America. And was it something more sinister than “just” about oil? Was it part of a strategy of introducing rule by fear, given the assaults on democratic principles that were “justified” within the context of this purported war on terror (such as the Patriot Act)?
Yes, Stiras1, you’re a jerk.
VM, the spam thing is ok. Even you’re not perfect. But I have a suggestion. Everytime I come to your blog I have a hard time going back to my own. I have to hit the return arrow on my laptop a gazillion times before I can get back to my site. I thought it was my computer but this doesn’t happen on any other blog or website I visit. So how about stopping by PGZ? We can trade jabs there just as well as we can here. And as for the links to the posts where you defended Bush, I didn’t see them. Really. So if it’s not too much to ask I’d like to have them again. I really want to read what you wrote about Bush. And yes, you DID call Bush a barbarian. Like I said, I believe it was in a post you wrote in November, but I could be wrong. You referred to him as a “barbarian president”. Yes, you did.
And JM, it’s nice to see you’re psychic and can read my mind. I didn’t know that my calling Obama Osama was a reference to Obama’s Muslim father. I thought it was a reference to my opinion that the Sultan of Surrender would be soft on terrorism. Silly me. Thanks for setting me straight.
Alex,you really need to think before you open your mouth. The Crusades were a response to centuries of on/off Muslim aggression against the West which began with the unprovoked attack on Constantinople (now Istanbul), the capital of the Eastern Roman Empire, in 717 AD. In case you can’t do the math, that was 378 years BEFORE the first Crusade. Learn some history, dude.
Oh, and Alex, if our democratic principles have been so assaulted how come you feel perfectly free to write the stuff you did? Aren’t you afraid you’ll be carried off in the middle of the night, never to be seen again?
I’m not too sure what your point is Seane-Anna. But irrespective of whether the example I use to illustrate my point is a good one or a bad one, wikipedia, for the purpose of an informal, online debate, serves to set the record straight regarding the Christian crusades:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusade
Now as far as your second point is concerned, any expression of opinion is accompanied by inherent risks and appropriate strategies. So again, what’s your point? In communist Russia, sometimes dissidents spoke out in spite of the risk. In the comfy west, people often keep quiet to preserve what they have, even as their rights are being eroded, so long as it is not them that is being targeted. Now, with the neocons safely out of the way, perhaps we can all breathe just a little bit easier. Your point?
Okay Stiras1, we are a lot closer than, say, most of the other Americans posting here!
What happened to Norway was barbaric, and what happened after WW2 was not all that much better. i.e. Soviet incursions that were a constant fact of life. I worked briefly with members of the Norwegian military, and it would be difficult to find a finer group of people.
I wish you well.
Sean-Anna you are the jerk. I get the feeling you really hate non american people. And that’s fine, becuase I really don’t care what you think of me, or my fellow “ameicanphobes”.
Just because we take the time to critizise the most powerful govenment in the world does not make us mean, it shows that we do care about what is going on in the world.
I don’t know how old you are, but your reminding me of a bitchy thirteen year old girl. Your childish and if I might add STUPID!!!!
I’m sorry for being unable to dicuss things in a calm way, but man she(or he) pushed me to the limit.
Oh and thank you Patrick Sperry. For a nice comment. You might be able to teach Sean-Anna a thing or two.
stiras1: Please don’t feed the troll.
Patrick: I’m not suggesting that irresponsible governments don’t muck around with dangerous substances. Saddam Hussein was a terrible man who killed and maimed many, many people (primarily Iranians, and his own people). But that wasn’t the reason we intervened.
About the oil thing: yes, it does make the world go around, and we’re going to continue to need it for a while. I think the Bush admin was so steeped in the oil industry that that’s all they could really understand. Their goals never changed.
But, unless they were hoping for kickbacks for themselves, I can’t understand how they thought the economics would work. The war and occupation are far more expensive than anyone was led to believe.
@SA: Toward the middle-end of this post there are a few links brought up showing where I had defended Bush. You might want to read the entire post anyway as I think it’s important.
SA, prepare yourself. My defending Bush against hyperbole and unwarranted attacks will never, in your book, be good enough. Your mind was made up about me long ago. I don’t expect it to change which is why some of my responses to you are lazily written.
Although this blog is mostly political, I’ve only rarely spoken about Bush. But you are also more than welcome to my archives that begin in Feb. of 2005. You’ll find a lot of my politics there as well.
Additionally, this “Bush was a barbarian president” thing that you bring up that you are committing to my having said needs to be proven by YOU as you are the one making the accusations. In any event, one could easily argue that Bush IS barbaric as he was aiding and abetting a barbaric war along with Gitmo torture tactics. So, who knows.. maybe I did say that?! But it is a trend with you that you are never able to quote me.And that’s frustrating!!
SA, you’re probably a lot of fun to go out and have drinks and shoot some pool with, but regarding politics and religion, I never see any grays in your arguments. Your thinking for the most part is too black and white which makes it hopeless to have a stimulating intense debate with you.
If arguing proves impossible later on, we can always agree to disagree. I mean, after all, politically (even though I’m not a true left liberal — see my political profile) we are polar opposites!!
About your not being able to return to your page after visiting mine, I have had those problems on other websites before and what I do is right click the back button and hit the site I had visited previously, and presto – I’m there!
By the way, save the name-calling. Attack the argument, not the arguer!!!!
“Your childish and if I might add STUPID!”
Stiras1, the “your” above should be “you’re” as in “You are childish”. I’m just saying.
“SA, you’re probably a lot of fun to go out and have drinks…with”
I don’t drink, VM, but I am a lot of fun! Thanks for the info on getting back to my blog from yours, and the offer to stop by PGZ still stands.